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	<title>Comments on: PE and Profits</title>
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	<link>http://jaredbernsteinblog.com/pe-and-profits/</link>
	<description>Facts, Thoughts, and Commentary</description>
	<lastBuildDate>Wed, 22 May 2013 23:54:06 +0000</lastBuildDate>
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	<item>
		<title>By: Michael</title>
		<link>http://jaredbernsteinblog.com/pe-and-profits/#comment-182153</link>
		<dc:creator>Michael</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Mon, 28 May 2012 20:30:34 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://jaredbernsteinblog.com/?p=5211#comment-182153</guid>
		<description><![CDATA[I really feel like the End of Fordism is a good way to understand a lot of the current vulture capitalism.]]></description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>I really feel like the End of Fordism is a good way to understand a lot of the current vulture capitalism.</p>
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		<title>By: readerOfTeaLeaves</title>
		<link>http://jaredbernsteinblog.com/pe-and-profits/#comment-178144</link>
		<dc:creator>readerOfTeaLeaves</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Thu, 24 May 2012 15:11:59 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://jaredbernsteinblog.com/?p=5211#comment-178144</guid>
		<description><![CDATA[Thanks!
Interesting point made early in the CO.edu paper -- PE leverages *mature* companies, whereas it&#039;s VC that actually engenders more innovation at early stages.

I realize that I tend to conflate the PE and VC, and I&#039;ll bet that I&#039;m not the only one who makes this error.  Unfortunately, this error lends PE a &#039;policy cache&#039; that it doesn&#039;t actually deserve; PE is assumed to be far more innovative than its actual role in the economy would justify.  (I suppose somewhat like mistaking a mortician for an obstetrician, if I might be so frank.)

This leads to policy and public opinion muddles.]]></description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Thanks!<br />
Interesting point made early in the CO.edu paper &#8212; PE leverages *mature* companies, whereas it&#8217;s VC that actually engenders more innovation at early stages.</p>
<p>I realize that I tend to conflate the PE and VC, and I&#8217;ll bet that I&#8217;m not the only one who makes this error.  Unfortunately, this error lends PE a &#8216;policy cache&#8217; that it doesn&#8217;t actually deserve; PE is assumed to be far more innovative than its actual role in the economy would justify.  (I suppose somewhat like mistaking a mortician for an obstetrician, if I might be so frank.)</p>
<p>This leads to policy and public opinion muddles.</p>
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		<title>By: Jared Bernstein</title>
		<link>http://jaredbernsteinblog.com/pe-and-profits/#comment-178005</link>
		<dc:creator>Jared Bernstein</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Thu, 24 May 2012 11:24:29 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://jaredbernsteinblog.com/?p=5211#comment-178005</guid>
		<description><![CDATA[Both facts I cited on that segments come from here http://jaredbernsteinblog.com/debt-financing-and-pe-an-unfortunate-marriage/

The debt financing point comes from a piece by Merrill Goozner, a crack journalist who knows this stuff very well (underlying source: http://leeds-faculty.colorado.edu/bhagat/LBO-VC.pdf), and the second--the fact that the tax system subsidizes debt--from a Brookings paper linked in my post.]]></description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Both facts I cited on that segments come from here <a href="http://jaredbernsteinblog.com/debt-financing-and-pe-an-unfortunate-marriage/" rel="nofollow">http://jaredbernsteinblog.com/debt-financing-and-pe-an-unfortunate-marriage/</a></p>
<p>The debt financing point comes from a piece by Merrill Goozner, a crack journalist who knows this stuff very well (underlying source: <a href="http://leeds-faculty.colorado.edu/bhagat/LBO-VC.pdf" rel="nofollow">http://leeds-faculty.colorado.edu/bhagat/LBO-VC.pdf</a>), and the second&#8211;the fact that the tax system subsidizes debt&#8211;from a Brookings paper linked in my post.</p>
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		<title>By: readerOfTeaLeaves</title>
		<link>http://jaredbernsteinblog.com/pe-and-profits/#comment-177826</link>
		<dc:creator>readerOfTeaLeaves</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Thu, 24 May 2012 06:36:52 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://jaredbernsteinblog.com/?p=5211#comment-177826</guid>
		<description><![CDATA[I happened to catch a segment of The Last Word on 5/23, on which Dr. Bernstein was a guest.  About halfway through the segment, he mentioned that:
(a) 60 - 90% of PE purchases (of companies) are debt-financed, and 
(b) every penny of that debt is tax-deductible, because
(c) the government heavily subsidizes PE leveraged buyouts via the tax code.

This leaves me with a question -- do PE firms ever receive a &#039;tax rebate&#039; for incurring vast amounts of leverage?
Second question: where did Dr. Bernstein come by the 60 - 90% stat?  

FWIW, I personally appreciate the courteousness  with which this topic was raised: I don&#039;t view Romney as intentionally evil.  I view him as a True Believer in financial capitalism.   He appears to believe that using Other People&#039;s Money to saddle companies with debt -- and then extract a share of profits which he off shores to the Caymans as his &#039;cut&#039; -- is &#039;capitalism&#039;, and it certainly does involve creative uses of capital.

I am not being snarky to state that I think Romney personifies the apotheosis of the GOP&#039;s (and Blue Dog Dems) political-economic ideology of the past 20+ years, and I believe the conversation starting to take place about Bain Capital and the role of PE (and finance) in the US economy is a critically important topic for the nation.

If it is true that PE firms can debt-finance 60 - 90% of their purchases -- which is actually simply a form of paying yourself a handsome fee to use Other People&#039;s Money (OPE) in order to load a third party down with unmanageable debt -- then Americans need to clearly understand that process.  
Because it&#039;s my view that this kind of economic parasitism helps explain larger problems in the US economy in recent decades.

I believe that &lt;em&gt;the way in which people make their money&lt;/em&gt; matters a great deal, both for their own lives and the health of their communities.

If that 60 - 90% statistic is accurate, that has enormous implications for HOW Romney made his money (even before he off shored so much of it), which is an economic and political issue that needs much more discussion.
Here&#039;s hoping...]]></description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>I happened to catch a segment of The Last Word on 5/23, on which Dr. Bernstein was a guest.  About halfway through the segment, he mentioned that:<br />
(a) 60 &#8211; 90% of PE purchases (of companies) are debt-financed, and<br />
(b) every penny of that debt is tax-deductible, because<br />
(c) the government heavily subsidizes PE leveraged buyouts via the tax code.</p>
<p>This leaves me with a question &#8212; do PE firms ever receive a &#8216;tax rebate&#8217; for incurring vast amounts of leverage?<br />
Second question: where did Dr. Bernstein come by the 60 &#8211; 90% stat?  </p>
<p>FWIW, I personally appreciate the courteousness  with which this topic was raised: I don&#8217;t view Romney as intentionally evil.  I view him as a True Believer in financial capitalism.   He appears to believe that using Other People&#8217;s Money to saddle companies with debt &#8212; and then extract a share of profits which he off shores to the Caymans as his &#8216;cut&#8217; &#8212; is &#8216;capitalism&#8217;, and it certainly does involve creative uses of capital.</p>
<p>I am not being snarky to state that I think Romney personifies the apotheosis of the GOP&#8217;s (and Blue Dog Dems) political-economic ideology of the past 20+ years, and I believe the conversation starting to take place about Bain Capital and the role of PE (and finance) in the US economy is a critically important topic for the nation.</p>
<p>If it is true that PE firms can debt-finance 60 &#8211; 90% of their purchases &#8212; which is actually simply a form of paying yourself a handsome fee to use Other People&#8217;s Money (OPE) in order to load a third party down with unmanageable debt &#8212; then Americans need to clearly understand that process.<br />
Because it&#8217;s my view that this kind of economic parasitism helps explain larger problems in the US economy in recent decades.</p>
<p>I believe that <em>the way in which people make their money</em> matters a great deal, both for their own lives and the health of their communities.</p>
<p>If that 60 &#8211; 90% statistic is accurate, that has enormous implications for HOW Romney made his money (even before he off shored so much of it), which is an economic and political issue that needs much more discussion.<br />
Here&#8217;s hoping&#8230;</p>
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		<title>By: pjr</title>
		<link>http://jaredbernsteinblog.com/pe-and-profits/#comment-177622</link>
		<dc:creator>pjr</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Thu, 24 May 2012 00:52:59 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://jaredbernsteinblog.com/?p=5211#comment-177622</guid>
		<description><![CDATA[Oops meant critique. Sorry.]]></description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Oops meant critique. Sorry.</p>
]]></content:encoded>
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		<title>By: pjr</title>
		<link>http://jaredbernsteinblog.com/pe-and-profits/#comment-177620</link>
		<dc:creator>pjr</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Thu, 24 May 2012 00:51:47 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://jaredbernsteinblog.com/?p=5211#comment-177620</guid>
		<description><![CDATA[Perry and Gingrich had plenty to say about Romney/Bain, and it resonated with many GOP voters. The Dems have their critic, but the GOP critic is equally strong.]]></description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Perry and Gingrich had plenty to say about Romney/Bain, and it resonated with many GOP voters. The Dems have their critic, but the GOP critic is equally strong.</p>
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		<title>By: D. C. Sessions</title>
		<link>http://jaredbernsteinblog.com/pe-and-profits/#comment-177557</link>
		<dc:creator>D. C. Sessions</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Thu, 24 May 2012 00:11:18 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://jaredbernsteinblog.com/?p=5211#comment-177557</guid>
		<description><![CDATA[Exactly: employees are rhetorical assets.]]></description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Exactly: employees are rhetorical assets.</p>
]]></content:encoded>
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		<title>By: vicki</title>
		<link>http://jaredbernsteinblog.com/pe-and-profits/#comment-177513</link>
		<dc:creator>vicki</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Wed, 23 May 2012 23:13:30 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://jaredbernsteinblog.com/?p=5211#comment-177513</guid>
		<description><![CDATA[Aren&#039;t employees seen as assets at all anymore?
::
Rhetorical. 
::]]></description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Aren&#8217;t employees seen as assets at all anymore?<br />
::<br />
Rhetorical.<br />
::</p>
]]></content:encoded>
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		<title>By: D. C. Sessions</title>
		<link>http://jaredbernsteinblog.com/pe-and-profits/#comment-177402</link>
		<dc:creator>D. C. Sessions</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Wed, 23 May 2012 20:37:06 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://jaredbernsteinblog.com/?p=5211#comment-177402</guid>
		<description><![CDATA[What I find interesting is that the headline PE model is a zero-sum process: the vulture capital comes in, leverages the company to unsustainable levels while pocketing the proceeds, and then lets the company, customers, employees, creditors, etc. fend for thThe $2 billion JPMorgan lost, someone else gained.emselves in the aftermath.

This ties very neatly (but not nicely) with one of the scariest things I ever heard from a Presidential candidate: last week, Mitt Romney commented on the Chase losses with: 

&lt;blockquote&gt;The $2 billion JPMorgan lost, someone else gained.&lt;/blockquote&gt;

In other words, the economy is a zero-sum game.  So what kind of President sees the US (or world) economy as one where for every man&#039;s hand is set against the rest?  And what does he mean to bring to that country, or that world?]]></description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>What I find interesting is that the headline PE model is a zero-sum process: the vulture capital comes in, leverages the company to unsustainable levels while pocketing the proceeds, and then lets the company, customers, employees, creditors, etc. fend for thThe $2 billion JPMorgan lost, someone else gained.emselves in the aftermath.</p>
<p>This ties very neatly (but not nicely) with one of the scariest things I ever heard from a Presidential candidate: last week, Mitt Romney commented on the Chase losses with: </p>
<blockquote><p>The $2 billion JPMorgan lost, someone else gained.</p></blockquote>
<p>In other words, the economy is a zero-sum game.  So what kind of President sees the US (or world) economy as one where for every man&#8217;s hand is set against the rest?  And what does he mean to bring to that country, or that world?</p>
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